Poll: What management model for the best ski experience at ORDA Ski Areas?

[phillipbelena]

I didn't mean to convey that I cared that your response was a bit OT, we major in off topic around here. I was just curious to know if you wish the ski areas were in private hands. (I don't think a private company would want to operate the venues without subsidy.)

Curious about the source of the quote.

One thing about skiers sharing the hill with groomers... maybe it has to do with pitch, blind rollovers and speed of skiers going down hill? Just a guess.

I have to say I am surprised by the (admittedly limited) results of the poll. I though for sure more would like to see the ski areas in private hands.

The ORDA venues would be much better in private hands, non-profit community run could be a model that works, like Bridger Foundation, Prospect Mountain, etc. I don't understand why NY State is in the ski business, the resources would be better directed towards SUNY, which has been severely underfunded for decades - but these are my interests, and I get why others might not be aligned with them.

 

[Deez]

Non-ORDA run ski mountain would have higher season pass and program prices.
Lightly checking Whiteface prices versus some Vermont prices - Whiteface is considerably cheaper.
I think ----if I remember correctly - West Mtn in Queensbury NY season pass is roughly the same as the ORDA Ski 3.

That being said - I totally agree with NYS shouldn't be running a ski mtn but I do enjoy the "lower" comparable prices....and in the end, for me, its about the savings.

 

[phillipbelena]

I don't like ORDA either. I'm of the opinion they are corrupt AF. But, how do you know they discontinued the up for strictly payback? To me, that seems like a stretch, at best.

Non-ORDA run ski mountain would have higher season pass and program prices.
Lightly checking Whiteface prices versus some Vermont prices - Whiteface is considerably cheaper.
I think ----if I remember correctly - West Mtn in Queensbury NY season pass is roughly the same as the ORDA Ski 3.

That being said - I totally agree with NYS shouldn't be running a ski mtn but I do enjoy the "lower" comparable prices....and in the end, for me, its about the savings

 

[phillipbelena]

You have to re-imagine how this would work…. Queensbury, Vermont, etc, that is not the model. This would work at whiteface, and vanho, because they have community, not sure about gore. https://bridgerbowl.com/. It is non profit community run. There is also the Bridger foundation, a more developed version of NYSEF.

 

[x10003q]

Non-ORDA run ski mountain would have higher season pass and program prices.
Lightly checking Whiteface prices versus some Vermont prices - Whiteface is considerably cheaper.
I think ----if I remember correctly - West Mtn in Queensbury NY season pass is roughly the same as the ORDA Ski 3.

That being said - I totally agree with NYS shouldn't be running a ski mtn but I do enjoy the "lower" comparable prices....and in the end, for me, its about the savings.

The EPIC Local pass is actually cheaper than ORDA Unlimited pass and the Ikon base pass is slightly more expensive than the matching limited ORDA ski 3 pass.

The Epic local is $689 today and that includes unlimited at many resorts across North America including :
Mount Snow, VT, Okemo, VT, Mount Sunapee, NH, Attitash Mountain Resort, NH, Wildcat Mountain, NH, Crotched Mountain, NH, Hunter Mountain, NY
The Unlimited ORDA Ski 3 is $1019 today. If you bought the unlimited before Aug 9 it would have cost $859.

The early purchase Ikon Base pass was $769 and that includes some holiday blackout dates at many resorts across North America. North East- Stratton/Sugarbush/Mt Tremblant plus 5 days at Killington/Pico, Sunday River, Sugarloaf, Loon, Windham
The limited ORDA Ski 3 with some holiday blackout dates from the same purchasing time frame was $699.

For the last 20 years, ORDA season passes have roughly matched New England season pass prices with some exceptions (for example: Stowe pre Epic).

 

[Campgottagopee]

Non-ORDA run ski mountain would have higher season pass and program prices.
Lightly checking Whiteface prices versus some Vermont prices - Whiteface is considerably cheaper.
I think ----if I remember correctly - West Mtn in Queensbury NY season pass is roughly the same as the ORDA Ski 3.

That being said - I totally agree with NYS shouldn't be running a ski mtn but I do enjoy the "lower" comparable prices....and in the end, for me, its about the savings.

They would get even higher if sold to a sole proprietor, as they should. ORDA is not held to task, meaning, no one is held accountable for making a profit. The skiing monopoly that NYS has is, at best, unfair.

 

[MarzNC]

https://bridgerbowl.com/. It is non profit community run. There is also the Bridger foundation, a more developed version of NYSEF.

Note that Bridger started out as a non-profit for tax purposes only quite a while ago. The university town of Bozeman provided a base of people who were both smart enough and had plenty of common sense about how to keep things running and growing without ever borrowing money. I started skiing Bridger in 2012 as part of trips to Big Sky. It's a unique situation that's working very well.

I don't get the sense that Whiteface, Gore, or Belleayre have the same type of base population to make those mountains work as non-profits.

July 2023

Profitable Nonprofits

Bogus Basin and Bridger Bowl are bigger than a lot of major resort, but operate with a mission to keep skiing affordable and ensure their communities are a

www.saminfo.com

 

[Deez]

Wow ! on the Epic and Ikon - had no idea ...that does seem like a good deal.

 

[x10003q]

The current situation of NY ownership is the best situation for skiers. ORDA continues to overspend NYS funds with zero accountability. They continue to underutilize Gore which means it remains an empty ski area. This is a gift for skiers. Belleayre's visits have increased quite a bit, but it too is still underused. If Epic remembers how to operate Hunter, those Belle numbers might be reduced. Whiteface gets loaded up with an hugely expensive, insane, bent HSQ the really does nothing for the existing mountain. But who cares? The money comes with no strings attached. The only surprise for me is that is this new bent HSQ is not a bubble style chair.

The other side of the coin is that ORDA continues to ignore North Creek and the towns surrounding Belleayre while piling big NYS $$$ into the money losing venues in and around Lake Placid. The WUG added nothing to the local economy, but no worries, nobody will have to answer for that huge mistake. In fact, they promoted a person who was highly involved with the WUG failure to run ORDA despite having zero experience with an organization the size and scope of ORDA.
Brilliant!!

If Gore and Belleayre where privately owned, the owners probably would work with the local towns to improve these areas that surround the ski areas, especially once you removed the Lake Placid/ORDA Board of Directors from the equation. Sadly, this will never happen.

 

[tirolski]

Wow ! on the Epic and Ikon - had no idea ...that does seem like a good deal.

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