The New Normal

[MarzNC]

Do you not feel that a neck warmer pulled up over mouth and nose qualifies as a mask. It’s not as good as medical style or n95, but many people are using cloth ear loop masks. If the material is the same, don’t you yhink it’s adequate?

Nope, not the same. Has to do with how big the "holes" are in the material on a microscopic level. Out west, the rules about what qualifies as a "mask" indoors are much clearer. Aerosols are really tiny.

Cloth masks are also not as effective as a surgical mask because of the internal structure of the material. There is a reason they aren't used by healthcare professionals working in a hospital. But someone who is aware enough to wear a cloth mask consistently might also be aware enough to avoid lengthy exposure to people who are potentially infectious and don't even know it.

For anyone who wants to see a scientific comparison at the microscopic level:

Microstructure analysis and image-based modelling of face masks for COVID-19 virus protection - Communications Materials

Face masks are key for slowing the spread of COVID-19. Here, the microstructure of three common masks is determined by x-ray tomography, combined with image-based modelling of droplet permeability, revealing that N95 masks are best for droplet filtration.

www.nature.com

 

[MarzNC]

Anyone remember the candle test by Bill Nye, the Science Guy?

July 2020

Coronavirus FAQ: What Does It Mean If I Can Blow Out A Candle While Wearing A Mask?

The candle test is one way to assess (roughly) the effectiveness of a mask. If your mask passes the test, you can help it do an even better job with some simple hacks.

www.npr.org

 

[witch hobble]

Nope, not the same. Has to do with how big the "holes" are in the material on a microscopic level. Out west, the rules about what qualifies as a "mask" indoors are much clearer. Aerosols are really tiny.

Cloth masks are also not as effective as a surgical mask because of the internal structure of the material. There is a reason they aren't used by healthcare professionals working in a hospital. But someone who is aware enough to wear a cloth mask consistently might also be aware enough to avoid lengthy exposure to people who are potentially infectious and don't even know it.

For anyone who wants to see a scientific comparison at the microscopic level:

Microstructure analysis and image-based modelling of face masks for COVID-19 virus protection - Communications Materials

Face masks are key for slowing the spread of COVID-19. Here, the microstructure of three common masks is determined by x-ray tomography, combined with image-based modelling of droplet permeability, revealing that N95 masks are best for droplet filtration.

www.nature.com

I understand all that. But the fact of the matter is….during the early days of the pandemic when there was a shortage of surgical masks, there was a big effort to increase production (both by businesses as well as home seamstresses) to make cloth masks. So MANY people are using cloth masks, but they have ear loops and the general shape of a surgical mask. But if the same material is used for a necky style mask, what is the difference? If we all know that masks are often just signaling to others that you are trying to comply, or on the flip side, that you take the virus seriously and would like people to give you space and respect, why not just use a necky at a ski area?

I fear that this is an area where the effort to limit the spread lost some of the low info, right leaning folks as we entered summer 2020.

We shouldn’t punish people who are making an attempt to do good because they are not doing the absolute best practices.

 

[Andy_ROC]

I agree with Sno in a lot of ways and I think that masking may have slowed down the process of getting us beyond this junk. Obviously that’s not the moral thing to say but nature doesn’t care about human concepts such as morals and ethics. Nature kills off the vulnerable and weak all the time for a healthier herd and ecosystem. You can think I’m a dick for saying that but that’s reality.

Of course we had to try to protect people and do what we thought was right but did that give us the best possible outcome? That’s hard to say and we’ll probably never really know but I I think it’s all questionable.

All emotions aside I agree in part. However the real danger for all of us, even if you can be 100% immune from covid, it has been the overloading on hospitals. I don't know about you but if I have a medical emergency, injury or illness, I expect first class medical care. The covid burden on hospitals and staff is profound and honestly that's about the only thing that is concerning at the moment.

Whether masks still help or not is irrelevant. If it helps others, especially employees feel more comfortable then I'm all for it. It's not really that hard to be considerate of others but some people really have a hard time looking beyond themselves.

I consider the daily sacrifices made by my grandparents here in the USA during WW2. By comparison wearing a mask is trivial.

 

[Harvey]

Do you not feel that a neck warmer pulled up over mouth and nose qualifies as a mask. It’s not as good as medical style or n95, but many people are using cloth ear loop masks. If the material is the same, don’t you yhink it’s adequate?

Honestly I have no idea. I assume n95 is best and anything else is less. Beyond that I'm not qualified to say what is a mask.

Once at Gore i used my balaclava to pee at the saddle, but i was pretty sure that was bs.

 

[raisingarizona]

All emotions aside I agree in part. However the real danger for all of us, even if you can be 100% immune from covid, it has been the overloading on hospitals. I don't know about you but if I have a medical emergency, injury or illness, I expect first class medical care. The covid burden on hospitals and staff is profound and honestly that's about the only thing that is concerning at the moment.

Whether masks still help or not is irrelevant. If it helps others, especially employees feel more comfortable then I'm all for it. It's not really that hard to be considerate of others but some people really have a hard time looking beyond themselves.

I consider the daily sacrifices made by my grandparents here in the USA during WW2. By comparison wearing a mask is trivial.

That’s totally fair as well. I’m ok wearing a mask if it’s required by a business or it puts others at ease, for now. At some point though we have to draw a line. It’s extremely easy to get carried away in all of this, especially if safety cops go unchecked and people want public mask wearing to stay as the new normal.

As far as American health care goes, I’m insured now but before I was I didn’t expect shit. It was basically the bare bones of care and a see ya later, here’s a 1200 dollar bill for that x Ray and ace bandage. Heal up buddy. I’m 46 and I didn’t have insurance until two years ago.

You must have very expensive health insurance with such high expectations. Most Americans don’t have that luxury.

 

[witch hobble]

Honestly I have no idea. I assume n95 is best and anything else is less. Beyond that I'm not qualified to say what is a mask.

Once at Gore i used my balaclava to pee at the saddle, but i was pretty sure that was bs.

*full disclosure: I live and ski in NH and have not even entered a lodge since March 2020. I make sure my necky is pulled up when in the corrals or around people.

What are other people wearing? What is being enforced (either by mountain personnel or courtnof public opinion/stink eye)? Did you go in the lodge last year? And if so probably not with an n95?

Also……why not just pee in the great outdoors? I’ll take fresh air and social distance over ski lodge bathrooms and masks and potential exposure.

 

[MarzNC]

We shouldn’t punish people who are making an attempt to do good because they are not doing the absolute best practices.

Personally I don't care if someone uses a buff or gaiter or cloth mask indoors to cover up their nose and mouth at a ski area. Was simply answering the question "is a buff the same as a cloth mask."

At Wolf Creek I was quite impressed with how many guys would pull up their buff when they walked inside. Awareness that they should try to help slow community spread was clearly high among the locals. They know that any hint of spread traced back to WCSA could mean no more indoor dining. There wasn't any indoor dining at WCSA the entire 2020-21 season.

 

[Harvey]

*full disclosure: I live and ski in NH and have not even entered a lodge since March 2020. I make sure my necky is pulled up when in the corrals or around people.

What are other people wearing? What is being enforced (either by mountain personnel or courtnof public opinion/stink eye)? Did you go in the lodge last year? And if so probably not with an n95?

Also……why not just pee in the great outdoors? I’ll take fresh air and social distance over ski lodge bathrooms and masks and potential exposure.

If you look at my original post I tried to imply that once the woods open up, I won't go inside. When only showcase is open, or terrain is very limited peeing on the trail doesn't seem like a great option

N95 is my mask. Last year, I skied in it all day. I read later that if you're n95 is wet, like from breathe, it's not much better than any other mask.

I didn't go inside last year.

This year so far I booted up inside (lodge is empty at 7:30) and maskup to leave if I leave before end of day.

 

[Harvey]

Personally I don't care if someone uses a buff or gaiter or cloth mask indoors to cover up their nose and mouth at a ski area.

I don't either. This is what I was saying about the change in me. I'm wearing a mask for others, and for respect.