The New Normal

[Brownski]

While covid deaths are 400,000 or whatever the total death rate is even higher than when you compare 2020 to 2019. I'm not sure by how much, but I know it's not a trivial amount.

I’ve heard people use the excess deaths number to argue that covid is really killing more people then is being reported but I’ve also heard that some regions are reporting anybody that dies “with” covid as dying “of” covid which would imply that the covid death numbers are actually inflated. I think we should also be careful not to ascribe deaths that are caused by the lockdowns to covid. Increased suicides and overdoses, people that die from heart disease or cancer because they were afraid to go to the hospital or maybe a drug trial was delayed that might have helped them. I don’t consider shutdown deaths to be covid deaths. That’s something else.

 

[Harvey]

I'm saying that the total number of deaths this year vs 19, is up more than the number of covid deaths. I believe that to be true, if wrong, I'll desist. How to describe what that is, is up to the individual I guess.

Personally if it's 400k or 500k it doesn't change any of my basic assumptions about covid.

 

[Brownski]

I understood what you were saying. It doesn’t affect what I do to protect myself but it is important to know the truth about what worked and what didn’t going forward and it’s important to understand how many people got hurt as unintended victims of bad decisions. The nursing home deaths is a good example. Plenty of people objected to that as it was happening but were ignored so it is important to understand what the thinking was behind that and to understand if that decision caused unnecessary deaths and how many.

 

[MarzNC]

Anybody who has really looked at the numbers and is being honest knows the numbers are undercounted. The death rate in the US is remarkably stable year to year. While covid deaths are 400,000 or whatever the total death rate is even higher than when you compare 2020 to 2019. I'm not sure by how much, but I know it's not a trivial amount.

Looking at deaths in the U.S. over the last five years. There are graphs by state of weekly deaths for 2020 from mid-March thru Dec. Can find similar graphs for other countries.

574,000 More U.S. Deaths Than Normal Since Covid-19 Struck (Published 2021)

Since the coronavirus pandemic began sweeping across the country last year, deaths have been 21 percent above normal. See the breakdown by state.

www.nytimes.com

 

[Harvey]

So it's only an additional 24k?

I admit it's less than I thought.

 

[MarzNC]

So it's only an additional 24k?

I admit it's less than I thought.

?? Article I posted said 424K more than the usual, based on data from the last five years. The graph is showing the Percent over/under with the range going from 10-40% starting around March 2020.

 

[MC2]

I’ve also heard that some regions are reporting anybody that dies “with” covid as dying “of” covid which would imply that the covid death numbers are actually inflated..

Be careful where you get your information.

Fact check: How are COVID-19 deaths counted, do hospitals get money for COVID-19 deaths?

(WLUK) -- Since the pandemic started, FOX 11 has received questions from viewers asking if hospitals are being paid for every COVID-19 death, and questions about how COVID deaths are counted. How COVID-19 deaths are counted. Determining the cause of death is up to a coroner, medical examiner or...

fox11online.com

 

[Harvey]

?? Article I posted said 424K more than the usual, based on data from the last five years. The graph is showing the Percent over/under with the range going from 10-40% starting around March 2020.

So it's double? That seems high. OK I will actually read the article.

 

[tirolski]

There’s more to covid effects than counting dead folks. Ask the many long haulers, and it hasn’t been that long yet.

 

[MarzNC]

There’s more to covid effects than counting dead folks. Ask the many long haulers, and it hasn’t been that long yet.

Yep, there is still much to be learned about COVID-19. Not really any good estimate of the true fatality rate, much less a break down by age and medical history. The impact for serious and long term symptoms varies a great deal.