Ski Bowl 3.0 at Gore

[tirolski]

...If the sewer system does not happen, Front Street Development-Ski Bowl Village will have to accept the poop from the lodge (as he signed in agreement with the TOJ and ORDA back in 2007) and currently he is not very excited about the prospect of having poop stored on his property

 

[Milo Maltbie]

The social thing was retorical. Anyone who answers is banned.

Still want Milo to define sustainable. My guess is it has something to do with producing as much as you consume.

G/wf/belle are getting 110 mil. I dont see how supporting nordic kid racing is such a crime. Its as legit as any lift.

Sustainable: ADJECTIVE
1.able to be maintained at a certain rate or level:
2.able to be upheld or defended:

A single XC event venue in a remote area that depends a manmade snow is a sketchy idea at best, but Ski Bowl is becoming the only training location as well. Clifton Park kids train there now. That's over an hour away, probably an hour and a half by bus. Back in the 1970's you could reliably ski at Albany Muni golf course, elevation 90 feet. That's not true anymore, and you can't reliably ski in Saratoga or Warren Counties either. XC is not gonna survive as a HS sport.

mm

 

[Milo Maltbie]

Somebody got awarded $800K.
That’s a lot of snicker$.

Ski Bowl Mountain Inn | Workforce Development

The Ski Bowl Mountain Inn at Gore Mountain is a 40 room Inn to be located in North Creek, NY. The Inn has been designed and permitted to be a traditional Adirondack Style Hotel with a main lodge and various guest cottages. The buildings will be set into the natural topography of the site and...

workforcedevelopment.ny.gov

I read that and I can't wait to see what the 2019 phase looks like.

mm

 

[Harvey]

Sustainable: ADJECTIVE
1.able to be maintained at a certain rate or level:
2.able to be upheld or defended:

I saw that in google results too.

What does it mean to you?

 

[Milo Maltbie]

That's not true. You should read the UMP. The bottom of Echo after Gully would be significantly widened, allowing one to return to the base even while a race is in progress. A connection from Twister is actually in the UMP, which you'd know if you read it. I think they would need a Killington style tunnel to cross under Echo. That is doable, but I'm not sure if it's a priority.

Really? A 300 foot tunnel under Echo? The UMP is to try to make Gore into Okemo by trading glades for groomers. You seem to want to turn it into some dystopian flat Hunter, only underground.

The constant stops and slows are precisely what makes it unpleasant. I hate that lift so much.

IT only stops because it's a nice part of the mountain for kids and for lower skilled skiers. If they didn't ski there they would be stoipping the High Peaks quad. Get over it. When Tawahus glade is open it's the best route back from Burnt Ridge, racing or not.

If it's a hard packed groomer day, and then Wood In is fine. If it's a powder day, spring day, or you're on a snowboard, then it sucks.

Even on those days it's easier than Striaghtbrook to Cloud. All of Gore is long traverses. If you don't like that, you don't like Gore.

mm

 

[snoloco]

Really? A 300 foot tunnel under Echo? The UMP is to try to make Gore into Okemo by trading glades for groomers. You seem to want to turn it into some dystopian flat Hunter, only underground.

It's not dystopian. It's enhancing connectivity between mountain areas. Sometimes that means trading glades for groomers. The trail is in the UMP, but the tunnel is not. All I'm saying is it could be done.

IT only stops because it's a nice part of the mountain for kids and for lower skilled skiers. If they didn't ski there they would be stoipping the High Peaks quad. Get over it. When Tawahus glade is open it's the best route back from Burnt Ridge, racing or not.

Get over it? I'd prefer to avoid that awful lift entirely by skiing directly to the base from Burnt Ridge, but I guess that's something you're opposed to.

 

[Alfredeneumann]

It's not dystopian. It's enhancing connectivity between mountain areas. Sometimes that means trading glades for groomers. The trail is in the UMP, but the tunnel is not. All I'm saying is it could be done.


Get over it? I'd prefer to avoid that awful lift entirely by skiing directly to the base from Burnt Ridge, but I guess that's something you're opposed to.

Trail on the existing service road from top of BR to Twister.
Loss of glades = 0
Tunnels required = 0
Cost = some dynamite and bulldozer time.

 

[Milo Maltbie]

It's not dystopian. It's enhancing connectivity between mountain areas. Sometimes that means trading glades for groomers. The trail is in the UMP, but the tunnel is not. All I'm saying is it could be done.


Get over it? I'd prefer to avoid that awful lift entirely by skiing directly to the base from Burnt Ridge, but I guess that's something you're opposed to.

Imagine the marketing potential of a tunnel. Longest ski tunnel in North America! Longer than the Bass Hole! The Snowbird of the East!
As long as we're proposing tunnels that will never be built, why not a tunnel from Rt28 to the Northway? I'd prefer to avoid that awful series of traffic lights in Warrensburg entirely by driving directly to Rt 28 from the Northway. That would save me more time each day than a few stoppages on the North quad, but I guess that's something you're opposed to.

mm

 

[Alfredeneumann]

A connection through Cirque wouldn't help anything. It would still be unavailable when Echo is closed. The real issue with Burnt Ridge is that it's hard to get to even when Echo is open. It would take Hunter Mountain amounts of excavation to make it easy to get to the BRQ from Twister, and they would still have to move NYSEF to Showcase or Sagamore. None of that's gonna happen.
It's always easy enough to get back from Burnt Ridge. Hedges or Tahawus glade to the North quad. That lift stops often because that's the best place to take 8 year olds at Gore. Otherwise it's about as fast as any other fixed grip. Also I don't get the hate on Wood In. That's always the easiest route to the High Peaks quad, and maybe even the easiest route to Straightbrook and Topridge as well.

Do you really think XC is sustainable as a HS sport on manmade snow? Are kids from Albany gonna train at the Ski Bowl? Saratoga County kids are already training there. Are there enough athletes outside Lake Placid in the Daks to justify it? AFAIK the Ski Bowl connection for alpine opened February 10 this year, and then only 3 days a week plus Presidents Week, so maybe 22 days if it opens this weekend. But sure, spend $30 million there because zipline.

mm

High school xc is certainly not sustainable if individual school districts have to make snow to have a venue, but it’s great to have a state facility with it so they can go there when there’s no natural snow at closer venues. Queensbury, Glens Falls, Saratoga and Shen, maybe others, are all using Gore for racing and training when necessary. My alma mater, Niskayuna, no longer has Nordic, which is where I first put skis on snow. Back then with dependable natural snow and grooming only for classic required, we trained and hosted some races on campus. Nisky still has an alpine team, which bused daily to Willard for training, probably still does.
Will Nordic at Gore be profitable? Of course not. Do the ski jumps or bob/luge runs make money? Are any of the 4 long track speed skating facilities in the country finishing in the black? Any velodromes? But we would never have any international athletes in any of those sports without those publicly funded facilities. More important than the few Olympic athletes developed are the dozens/scores/hundreds who get to try or participate in those sports who may never make it to a nationals, let alone Olympics. Their passion for their sports is no less, probably more, than yours for recreational alpine skiing.
Will ORDA lose money on Nordic at Gore? Of course it will. Is it worth it? Yes.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

I like the idea.

Right now employees must be commuting. An apartment building for labor, either cheap or included as a benefit would make it easier to staff the mountain, and those workers would spend more of their income in North Creek. They could build something great for less than the lodge.

I generally like the idea of employee housing. That said, if one loses their job, they probably get evicted right away. That's the way it worked when I lived in employee housing. At the time, the average age of the employee was, maybe 20. With an older workforce, that would be disruptive and sounds to me like a bureaucratic nightmare.