ORDA Snowmaking Improvements

[snoloco]

So now the Gore snow report indicates snowmaking on Echo, The Gully, Cedars, Hedges, Sagamore, Lies, and Lower Darby. This is much more in line with what we've seen post-2018 upgrade. Seems they can do 2 trails that are of front side length, plus a little extra.

 

[tirolski]

According to this data:

ORDA Skier Visits: Whiteface, Gore, Belleayre

NYSkiBlog's update of ORDA skier visits and revenue for NY's state-owned ski areas, Whiteface, Gore Mountain and Belleayre Ski Center.

nyskiblog.com

Skiers visits have remained static, but revenue has increased by two-thirds.

Screenshot of a Board meeting slide.
2018 to 2022 Season Pass Revenue down to the dang penny and/or quarters.

 

[x10003q]

According to this data:

ORDA Skier Visits: Whiteface, Gore, Belleayre

NYSkiBlog's update of ORDA skier visits and revenue for NY's state-owned ski areas, Whiteface, Gore Mountain and Belleayre Ski Center.

nyskiblog.com

Skiers visits have remained static, but revenue has increased by two-thirds. That's pretty solid from an ORDA-centric view, but it doesn't help the local area like you rightly point out. The problem for local businesses is that a ski season is at best 3-5 months of the year. There is admittedly not a lot to do around Gore besides ski so people generally don't stick around. Meanwhile, it is too financially risky for a private company/individual to open/operate restaurants, hotels, bars, shopping, etc. So North Creek continues to be sleepy. Hence, the government steps in to foster growth. Ziplines, bike trails, wedding facilities, foliage festivals, etc to attract more year-round visits. This is what will make the difference between a local business thriving for a few weeks and being sustainable year-round and ORDA's budget is spending money to lure that customer. If there is more year-round demand, it will likely lead to more business formations and economic benefit to the area. I think we have to look beyond just skier visits and ascertain if there has been an increase in summer/fall visits over the past decade-plus.

The Gore revenue is not indexed and it is subject to inflation. Skier visits give the accurate accounting of what is happening at Gore. If ORDA had ever marketed Gore properly, there would have been increases in the apres-ski in and around North Creek to support the increased skier visits. Depending on what site used, $1 dollar in 2004 is equivalent to the purchasing power of $1.57 today which roughly matches Gore's increase in revenue.

$1 in 2004 → 2024 | Inflation Calculator

The 2.60% inflation rate means $1 in 2004 is equivalent to $1.67 today. This inflation calculator uses the official US consumer price index published by the Department of Labor.

www.in2013dollars.com

 

[Tjf1967]

The Gore revenue is not indexed and it is subject to inflation. Skier visits give the accurate accounting of what is happening at Gore. If ORDA had ever marketed Gore properly, there would have been increases in the apres-ski in and around North Creek to support the increased skier visits. Depending on what site used, $1 dollar in 2004 is equivalent to the purchasing power of $1.57 today which roughly matches Gore's increase in revenue.

$1 in 2004 → 2024 | Inflation Calculator

The 2.60% inflation rate means $1 in 2004 is equivalent to $1.67 today. This inflation calculator uses the official US consumer price index published by the Department of Labor.

www.in2013dollars.com

Wasn't an empty resort good for you? I guess the value of your property did not go up fast enough?

 

[tirolski]

If ORDA had ever marketed Gore properly, there would have been increases in the apres-ski in and around North Creek to support the increased skier visits.

Leave the marketing BS to Vail.
If folks can’t find Gore in this day and age of the internets they’ll just get even more lost when skiing it.

 

[snoloco]

ORDA's snowmaking improvements can be divided into two categories.

One is efficiency upgrades. Includes more fixed equipment, low-e guns, and automation.

Two is capacity, more specifically in the form of better water distribution.

The first category reduces costs by reducing air consumption, and reducing the need for time consuming set-ups and having to move equipment around. It also helps to increase the amount of snow made, by increasing uptime, and keeping the system on the water side of the curve more often than not.

The second category increases the GPM per acre, which is the ultimate limiting factor for any snowmaking system. No matter how many efficiency upgrades you do, there is no working around this limit.

If you keep track of how what trails each resort makes snow on, you can definitely see a difference. At Belleayre, they used to be able to do roughly 2 trails at a time, but now they can do about 5. Gore used to only be able to open Burnt Ridge one trail at a time, but this year, they are going to open it with both Echo and Sagamore. At Whiteface, they are now working on Upper and Lower Skyward at the same time, which they never did before.

 

[tirolski]

ORDA's snowmaking improvements can be divided into two categories.

Two is capacity, more specifically in the form of better water distribution.

The second category increases the GPM per acre, which is the ultimate limiting factor for any snowmaking system. No matter how many efficiency upgrades you do, there is no working around this limit.

Ya might wanna vote Snoloco.
"The Belleayre team laid a massive 60,000 feet of new pipe this year, installed 300 brand new low-energy, high-efficiency snow guns, added a new pump to their fleet, and brought on and trained new crew members. Now, they can make more snow, faster than ever, using less energy than ever, too."

https://www.belleayre.com/vote-for-the-belleayre-snowmaking-team/

 

[jimmypete]

"Also feels like the DMV or social security without the guns... Not necessarily inviting like Plattekill where you feel like you're home when you walk in." I like this sentence just don't know what it means

 

[tirolski]

"Also feels like the DMV or social security without the guns... Not necessarily inviting like Plattekill where you feel like you're home when you walk in." I like this sentence just don't know what it means

Think Cheers

Where Everyone Knows Your Name | Plattekill Mountain

Saturday: What David said: The gang’s all here. It’s that day in January where everyone you...

plattekill.com

Sheesh

 

[snoloco]

So Gore is done with the university games, so maybe time to catch up on trail expansion? Maybe open the rest of the summit trails, or Sleeping Bear, or the Ski Bowl?

Nope.

Making even more snow on Wild Air for yet another park event. You've gotta be kidding me. Sure they upgraded their snowmaking. It's just that the majority of their customers won't get to ski most of it.