Ski Industry "Debundling"

[Harvey]

Speaking of Lot H, what Stowe did would be the equivalent of Gore making lots A thru G paid parking and leaving only Lot H and the ski bowl free. At Stowe, while there is technically some free parking at Toll House or the Cross Country Center, the lots are small, far away, and have limited shuttle or lift service. The vast majority of their guests are going to have to pay the 30 dollars.

Megapass.

 

[snoloco]

I'm just saying that's the magnitude of what Stowe did. Mount Snow's paid parking would be more equivalent to also leaving lots F and G as free. Also note that they conveniently excluded parking from being eligible for the 20% discount that passholders get on most other resort spending.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

I have a Killington Beast 365 Pass, Ikon Base Pass, and ORDA Ski3 Pass.

Wow.

 

[Ripitz]

I see mega passes as the driver here. I won't buy one.

SANY Gold Pass is pretty mega, just sayin.

 

[riverc0il]

Not sure what was mentioned about Cannon on AZ, but I see that Cannon is holding on to their no bags policy (which began during COVID). COVID provided ski areas a reason to do something they long wanted to do.

Bags can get out of hand in some lodges as Cannon. Notchview was always very well contained, though. Not sure what their "outdoor storage" situation is like. Sounds like a good way to freeze your lunch.

MRG's recent Base Box renovation specifically targeted expanding bag storage. They made a lot of impressive upgrades. The renovated Base Box is amazing and fixes a lot of issues, while still retaining many of its quirks and charms. Jay made free back storage easier when they updated their Stateside lodge. Some areas are doing right by their skiers.

Bag storage has been an on again and off again issue for well over a dozen years. COVID accelerated the move to paid systems and eliminating options. It is being done at a variety of areas, including non-mega pass mountains. I don't think this is a mega-pass issue.

Regarding paid parking, mega-resorts that used to charge four figures for a pass made their own parking problems by cutting their pass prices more than 50%. Now they are trying to make it up on the backend. Don't like it? Don't ski there.

I don't understand complaining about the issue yet continuing to buy passes from places that implement these policies. That isn't going to fix the issue. It only makes the situation worse, as it justifies their decision.

 

[tirolski]

What dontcha understand about ancillary”?
It’s Vail Resorts Ink’s newest normal.

"Our strongest growth occurred in destination markets, which represents the largest addressable market for conversion of guests into advanced commitment and is a particularly attractive guest segment given the higher ancillary attachment.
Our Epic Day Pass continues to be our highest growth product segment, targeting the large market of lower frequency skiers into advanced commitment and particularly destination guests with valuable ancillary spend."

Vail Resorts, Inc. (MTN) Q1 2023 Earnings Call Transcript

Vail Resorts, Inc. (NYSE:NYSE:MTN) Q1 2023 Earnings Conference Call December 9, 2022 8:30 AM ET Company Participants Kirsten Lynch - Chief Executive Officer Michael Barkin - Executive Vice...

seekingalpha.com

We've brought shrimps & chocolates for the workers locally. It ain’t Vail.
Many times just skied to the car when the snow allowed.

 

[Harvey]

SANY Gold Pass is pretty mega, just sayin.

 

[Ripitz]

Mega means huge, that’s all I was trying to say. When a ski pass covers almost all of the ski areas in NY that’s pretty huge. Indy is huge now too. I think both are mega awesome. Not trying to equate them to Ikon or Epic. Sorry about the mix up.

 

[snoloco]

I think it's almost certainly Waterville Valley that Skiology Matt referenced in the original post I shared. I saw another post on Ski The East Group that described a rather expensive and punitive system. You have to pay 10 dollars to check your bag, or rent a locker for 5, 10, or 15 dollars depending on size. If you leave it under a table or against the wall, it gets confiscated and you have to pay 15 dollars to get it back. The only other option is to leave it in the car, and if you look at Google Earth, you'll notice that much of their parking is far away and requires walking up a steep hill to get to the lodge. Also, Waterville Valley is not on Epic or Ikon, so this is not limited to megapass resorts.

MRG's recent Base Box renovation specifically targeted expanding bag storage. They made a lot of impressive upgrades. The renovated Base Box is amazing and fixes a lot of issues, while still retaining many of its quirks and charms. Jay made free back storage easier when they updated their Stateside lodge. Some areas are doing right by their skiers.

The new K1 Lodge has a free bag check on the main level and racks downstairs. Plenty of room for everyone's stuff.

Bag storage has been an on again and off again issue for well over a dozen years. COVID accelerated the move to paid systems and eliminating options. It is being done at a variety of areas, including non-mega pass mountains. I don't think this is a mega-pass issue.

See my note about Waterville Valley. Definitely not confined to mega pass resorts. The problem is if you eliminate all free bag storage, you are just asking for people to leave their stuff under tables in the cafeteria or in other obstructive locations. You can provide free bag storage which costs essentially nothing to provide, or do what Waterville Valley did and go the heavy-handed, punitive enforcement route.

Regarding paid parking, mega-resorts that used to charge four figures for a pass made their own parking problems by cutting their pass prices more than 50%. Now they are trying to make it up on the backend. Don't like it? Don't ski there.

I don't understand complaining about the issue yet continuing to buy passes from places that implement these policies. That isn't going to fix the issue. It only makes the situation worse, as it justifies their decision.

The 3 resorts in the northeast with non-optional paid parking are Camelback, Mount Snow, and Stowe. I have no plans to visit any of them, so I'm not sure why you are accusing me of justifying their decisions.

 

[Campgottagopee]

It's not cheaper to run a ski area than it was 10 years ago. But mega passes have reduced the cost of a lift ticket (per day). It's the natural outcome. What did you expect?

Stowe pass used to be $2000 now you can get one for $600 or whatever. Of course you are going to get charged for parking and everything else.

This is it.
Everything is so expensive. I can't blame a business looking to make money, without it they won't be around.