ICE v Electric: Cost and Emissions

[Harvey]

What happened to DomB who was keeping us up to date with his Rivian order and associated electric vehicle updates and information?

Maybe he's a winter only forum guy.

 

[DomB]

Maybe he's a winter only forum guy.

Hey guys! Yes, sorry I disappeared. I am definitely more of a winter guy (though I love the forum and really enjoyed the posts I have seen this summer, including Rip's touching one about his summer solstice hike.

The long and short is that they have prioritized pushing out the trucks over the SUVs. There are signs that the SUV is now getting prioritized for the first time since deliveries started to non-affiliates. They are having this issue because they only have one line for R1 truck or SUVs, so for now, they have to batch between the Trucks and the SUV. The SUV got delayed a few months so they could stick to trucks and deliver more. They apparently made that choice due to the complexity in ramping up production volume. No one know the exact number in real time (they disclose quarterly afterward), but they are getting close to 10,000 R1's produced. Their year-end goal is 25,000 total vehicles, including Amazon vans (cut from 50,000 but reaffirmed).

Here is where we are:
- we are starting to see 'real' non affiliate deliveries of the SUV. It looks like at least one confirmed delivery this past Friday.
- some non-affiliates with media ties are getting them. There are a handful of early pre-order holders (Dec 2018) that stared a forum, who both just got delivery of their vehicles.
- while I was about 50-50 that I would not get the SUV order in this year a week ago, I think the odds are like 75% chance. The first two SUV delivery windows are Aug-Sept and Oct-Dec. I am in the Oct-Dec bucket. Someone who ordered a month ahead of me with a similar build (but with a 2k underbody shield) is getting invited to finalize the process, which takes a few days to weeks before a delivery.
- but this is hard to predict. While they are considering order date, they are prioritizing batches for builds. I have a common exterior color (Launch Green) but did not get the underbody shield, as hard core offroading will be a very limited use case. Mostly offroad will be soft sand.

They have done some things they say are to stream line production like modifying an interior color (white - you hav to take a black dash, which I am fine with) and removing the base trim.

I am not sure, but I think if you put in a reservation now, you are NOT locking into a price. This kind of makes sense because the price of so many materials have gone up.

 

[DomB]

I personally hope it comes through soon, as my daily driver is an 11 year old CRV that gets beat up, has about 136,000 miles, and has had a transmission fault indicator come on almost every time it has been driven the past few weeks. I guess if it dies before the Rivian is ready (unlikely), we could just go to one car for a while.

Our back up is an 8 year old impreza with 20,000 miles on it. We bought it when we moved to burbs to be driven to the train station, but since then we moved to another town and I walk to the train, so it mostly gets used on weekends if there is some conflict with kid events or one of us wants to go somewhere else.

 

[Sbob]

I saw Rivian Suv today unfortunately going in the opposite direction but noticed that the headlights were on. Is this an automatic function? I would think even though they’re LED’s that would reduce the range a bit?

 

[Milo Maltbie]

I haven't seen one. But school busses seem like they could a good choice for EVs. Routes aren't that long (?) so range maybe not an issue as much, and one charging station could charge a bunch of vehicles. And when they stop they aren't running.

Still want to see WTF we do with the batteries. Mining and disposal/recycling. Anyone seeing any innovation on that?

There’s gonna be a big push for EV school busses. I’ve already seen articles claiming diesel exhaust from school buses takes 5 points off kids’ IQ. BUses are the best use of batteries.

Spent vehicle batteries aren’t dead, it’s just that the power to weight ratio has deteriorated. Those are perfect for grid connected stationary batteries. You still need to recycle them, but the life cycle is much longer. More batteries allows more renewable energy.

Any technology that supports a modern economy for 7 billion people is gonna have some environmental consequences.


mm

 

[Campgottagopee]

I’ve already seen articles claiming diesel exhaust from school buses takes 5 points off kids’ IQ.

LMFAO!

 

[Harvey]

Spent vehicle batteries aren’t dead, it’s just that the power to weight ratio has deteriorated. Those are perfect for grid connected stationary batteries. You still need to recycle them, but the life cycle is much longer. More batteries allows more renewable energy.

I knew that car batteries still had a useful life at the end of the run, and reusing them for something else is recycling. This doesn't change the fact eventually, at the end of the line, you got do something.

 

[jasonwx]

Fun fact
Most of the recycled lead from used car batteries goes into the manufacturing of bullets

 

[Harvey]

With all these EVs coming Camp is going to have to up his game.

 

[Milo Maltbie]

I knew that car batteries still had a useful life at the end of the run, and reusing them for something else is recycling. This doesn't change the fact eventually, at the end of the line, you got do something.

That's true, but the point is the disposal problem is maybe a quarter of what you might have thought it was, and way further down the line before the volume gets large. Don't be like my grandfather who told me that electric starters would never workbe a disaster because of all the lead and acid that would need to be dumped.

mm