The New Normal

[Sbob]

Do you know much about Bossche? He was discussed on another ski forum a while back. He's a veterinarian in Belgium. I also discussed the topic with my immunologist friend. She understands what NK cells do, as well as T-cells/B-cells, a lot better than I do. She took the time to read his "open letter" to WHO carefully, as well as what the Snopes article.

Geert Vanden Bossche Stokes Fear of COVID-19 Vaccine To Promote His Own Flawed ‘Solution’

A veterinarian suspiciously says the only way to prevent a COVID-19 vaccine-related calamity is through a product he claims to have invented.

www.snopes.com

Masking and the 3 Cs is always a good idea because of Delta, whether vaccinated or not. The idea is to avoid Closed Spaces, Crowded Spaces, and Close Contact. That's based on new data and research in the past two months since this particular variant entered the U.S. Bottom line is that Delta stays in the nose more and that makes it more transmissible for at day or two even by people who are vaccinated but have so much exposure that they get infected with SARS-CoV-2. If more people understood how to avoid adding to community spread, having 30-50% unvaccinated people in a community wouldn't be overloading so many hospitals.

The two videos I watched Bossche didn’t appear to be selling anything. I am somewhat familiar with natural killer cells. A while ago I invested in a company that is heavy into the technology. Nantkwest now Immunity Bio . Sorrento therapeutics I believe is also working on a NK based treatment for covid. If he an invented NK cell treatment he’s not the first.
Always good to get information from as many sources as possible and sort it out.

 

[Harvey]

The internet is worthless up here at night, but I had a feeling you guys were cranking out the pages here!

I definitely haven't done the kind of reading that CNY asks about. I wouldn't be surprised if there are some side affects that aren't fully understood now.

I'm making my best guess as to which has lower risk, vax or not? Isn't everyone doing that? IMO it's normal to get different answers from people who come from a different place, and get their information from different places.

Also IMO it's normal for me to want you to come to the same conclusion I did, and visa versa.

 

[MarzNC]

I wouldn't be surprised if there are some side affects that aren't fully understood now.

That was true in Dec 2020 when the people in multiple countries starting getting shots for Pfizer and Moderna. Given that was over 6 months ago, and millions of adults have had these vaccines, the safety profile is unlikely to has missed any serious adverse events.

What changed after the blood clot issue surface is that the list of adverse events was expanded, and the type and timing of symptoms related to that rare issue were clarified. My understanding is that if someone notices those symptoms and is treated promptly, the risk of serious complications or death is very low. That's true for all sorts of reactions to medication. Every drug or vaccine has potential side affects.

The CDC continues to update the webpage about potential side effects for Covid vaccines.

What to Expect after Getting a COVID-19 Vaccine

Learn about the potential side effects of the COVID-19 vaccine.

www.cdc.gov

 

[MarzNC]

AP did some fact checking after a school board meeting in Indiana. In Tennessee, doctors and nurses who spoke in favor of requiring masks for K-12 schools were actively threatened as they left the building. <sigh>

August 13, 2021

FACT FOCUS: Indiana doctor’s speech spreads COVID falsehoods

An Indiana doctor’s recent appearance at a small community school board meeting northeast of Indianapolis has racked up tens of millions of views across social media this week, with users falsely claiming it included facts about COVID-19 that the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and the fe

apnews.com

 

[Harvey]

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I wouldn't be surprised if there are some side affects that aren't fully understood now.

I also wouldn't be surprised is there are none beyond those already reported.

How many billions served?

 

[MarzNC]

How many billions served?

Not going to pass McD any time soon.

August 13, 2021

Bloomberg - Are you a robot?

This article in Nature was based on 1.7 billion doses around the world as of early June. Some of the findings may be outdated because the research was done well before Delta was everywhere.

June 4, 2021

Six months of COVID vaccines: what 1.7 billion doses have taught scientists

At a pivotal moment in the pandemic, Nature explores key questions about the vaccines that countries are racing to deliver while viral variants spread around the globe.

www.nature.com

Graph is for the U.S. only, as of Aug. 13. An average of 1 million doses per day for 5 months would be about 150 million for Pfizer only.

 

[MarzNC]

@Sbob : here's an example of a genomic report for Maine. Over 5000 samples have been analyzed since March. In July 2021, 86% of the samples were Delta.

https://www.maine.gov/dhhs/mecdc/infectious-disease/epi/airborne/documents/SARS-CoV-2-Sequencing-Summary-8-6.pdf

 

[Harvey]

It's just a song:

I wish it was funnier, at least it's only 3 minutes.

 

[CNY Skier]

I'm guessing that's because most of us thought your post was silly and not worth responding to, but since you've asked ...

Why? Well, perhaps it would be best to answer that question like this. Do you still ski in leather boots on wooden skis with no metal edges and cables or straps to attach the boots to the skis? Do you use a horse-drawn carriage to go to work, or the store, or to visit family? Do you use candles to light your home? Do surgeons cut your knee open to repair a torn ACL or do they use a laparoscope? Do doctors perform exploratory surgery to find out what's wrong with you or do they use a CAT-scan or MRI? Are people forced to wear eye-glasses or contact lenses for their entire lives or has LASIK eye surgery freed them from that? Do you use the internet to express your thoughts and opinions, or do you write them down on a piece of paper and hang it in the public square?

mRNA vaccines have been researched and under development since the mid-1980's. They are easier to produce, quicker to produce, can be scaled up for large-scale production quickly and, in the end, produce the same result as traditional vaccines ... they enable the body to provide an immune response to a virus.

Awesome ... good for you. Whether or not you get vaccinated for COVID-19 should be your decision. If you make that decision, and don't end up contracting COVID-19, good for you. If you make that decision, and do contract COVID-19 and survive, good for you. If you make that decision, and do contract COVID-19 and die, good for you. I don't really think anyone cares what you do. What they do care about, however, is that you'll be respectful of other people's liberties, and do everything possible to avoid transmitting the virus to others. Put another way ... if you want to get into your car on an empty road and drive into a tree at 120 miles per hours, go for it ... just make sure you don't take out anyone else with you.

Believe what you want ... once again ... no one cares. As to your question, I believe what "the experts" are saying is quite simply, "We're not sure" ... we believe the vaccine works, so whether you've had COVID-19 or not, if you get vaccinated, we believe that you'll have a greater degree of immunity, but do what you want.

Yeah, this online posting is hard because you don't know me, I don't know you, etc. Apologize if I come off arrogant but assure you that I am always trying to learn and discover the truth. My favorite quote (Keynes?) is "When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" And of course, medicine changes and we benefit from the new-found knowledge.

Your comment ... "the expert's" are saying "We're not sure but we believe the vaccine works...greater degree of immunity, etc." is what troubles me. Based on my county's website two days ago, the immunity argument is shot. 45% of all new "cases" are from vaccinated people. That is pretty close to 50/50 and implies that the vaccine does nothing to prevent new cases. Their argument is that you may get infected but a vaccine will prevent you from getting sick, etc. I haven't been able to find enough data to prove or disprove this claim. That said, I do know what will help prevent you from getting sick - staying fit/trim and making sure you have a good immune system. This is the low cost low-hanging fruit so to speak.

I should have know better to enter this foray. Once someone gets the vaccination they have a natural inclination to defend their decision. I get that. All I was trying to do is explain why some of us have chosen otherwise. We are facing a scary mob mentality situation but most of us will refuse to be part of this experiment. Let the cards fall where they may.

Skiing, anyone? I just booked a two week AirBNB in Vermont for this Winter and am looking forward to having a great time! Family and friend will visit and I will have the pleasure of teaching my two grandchildren to ski! That will be two generations for me and I could not be happier!

 

[sibhusky]

That said, I do know what will help prevent you from getting sick - staying fit/trim and making sure you have a good immune system. This is the low cost low-hanging fruit so to speak.

And yet, there is one tale after another of extremely fit people ending up in the hospital. While, IN THE HOSPITAL over 90% of the cases are unvaccinated. Now, it may be that it's only the fit people that the media wants to tell us about, but being fit is clearly not as good a shield against Delta as you seem to think. And we've got KIDS who can't get vaccinated ending up there. We have to take responsibility not just for ourselves, but for all with whom we come in contact. Because that perfectly fit looking person in the chair six feet away from you at the car dealer may not even be aware that they are immunocompromised.

I'm vaccinated. I still wear a mask, I've got plenty and I have found quite a few that don't bother me in the least to wear. I do this because it's my duty as a human to my fellow humans. I'm not much on organized religion, but just as I help people who look like they are in trouble when I'm skiing, I don't wish to inadvertently spread this damn disease any more and I want to resume a normal life. The sooner we all start pulling together, the sooner we win.