F Vail

[Harvey]

I was wondering about the cost of living up there.

The mountain bike trails sure look expensive, and awesome.

With NoVT (?) probably the most reliable snow in the "east."

 

[raisingarizona]

With NoVT (?) probably the most reliable snow in the "east."

Copper Harbor, Michigan

 

[G.ski]

They need offer $20 because the closest town, Copper Harbor, has a population of 85 and they all have 3 jobs already.

Yeah $18 won't cut it nowadays.
School bus driver openings here in Dutchess are paying $21 an hour with a $3000 signing bonus.

 

[snoloco]

After reading the complaints and other comments I have to file that under first world problems. Wind happens. Ski areas out here are in desperation mode trying to get Christmas vacation bookings. It’s been scary warm.

It was high winds. The gondola could not run. Not sure what else could have been done other than to wait or shuttle people out with the vehicles they had, which they did. No one was in danger. I think the real problems here were poor communication, and the fact that it took 4 hours to even start getting people out.

 

[Ripitz]

It was high winds

That blows

 

[Andy_ROC]

They need offer $20 because the closest town, Copper Harbor, has a population of 85 and they all have 3 jobs already.

Doesn't help that cost of living and real estate is so high that those with service jobs can't afford to live in anything beside barracks housing, a car or cardboard box. But at least the really rich people have gobbled up all the land so they can enjoy their $5M homes for 1 week a year that otherwise sit vacant or as an airbnb.

 

[raisingarizona]

Doesn't help that cost of living and real estate is so high that those with service jobs can't afford to live in anything beside barracks housing, a car or cardboard box. But at least the really rich people have gobbled up all the land so they can enjoy their $5M homes for 1 week a year that otherwise sit vacant or as an airbnb.

Everything is pretty f-d at this point.

I was talking to a coworker the other day about this and the conversation went into how every civilization and nation has a lifespan to it and we are unfortunately at our end. It is what it is.

Has anyone here payed attention to the homeless crisis all along the west coast this past year? Things are getting ugly.

 

[snoloco]

You sure jumped quickly from "there's a problem in many ski towns that needs to be solved" to "it's the end of the world". There are ways to solve a housing shortage. Limits on short term rentals, deed restrictions, empty home taxes, and increasing zoning density can all help. They're going to need to find a way because if businesses are so short staffed that they can't function, then property values (and STR revenue) are going to plummet.

 

[tirolski]

What does this have to do with F Vail? Askin for a friend.

 

[Harvey]

I can see how it's related. Not saying all is Vail's fault, but maybe they are part of it.

Some ski towns (out west especially?) are so expensive that the staff can't afford to live there. Snoloco is right about one thing, if all the ops quit, the market will compensate. Wages will rise, or conditions will improve, because no one at the top is going to let those assets (lifts, etc) sit idle.

For whatever reason, people seem a lot less afraid to quit these days. It's having a profound effect. I know the theory well, but never thought I would see the effect this dramatically.

Vail is certainly part of it. Driving up the cost and target market for skiing.

I actually think snowmaking, and the expectation of a 3-4 month season, in the low-elevation east, is part of it. Snowmaking is really expensive and reliance on it seems to be increasing. If you have high fixed cost, you gotta maximize your money per skier, or pack em in, or both. Your properties have to cater to the rich, and do big volume.

IF my idea is legit, it would mean we too are complicit.