Killington Village Discussion

[snoloco]

I wanted to start a separate thread for all discussion of the Killington village. I'll also post any construction updates in here. That should start this summer. I've started by cross-posting what I already put in the conditions thread.

Killington voters pass $47M TIF bond, approve new town hall - The Mountain Times

Development of the town’s water system set to begin this summer By Polly Mikula On Town Meeting Day, 75% of Killington voters approved Article 5, giving the town authorization to proceed with water and road infrastructure projects that will support […] Read More

mountaintimes.info

The entire future of Killington was riding on Tax Increment Financing, or TIF being approved by voters. This 47 million dollar bond will be paid off by taxes on the new units constructed in the proposed base village, and not increase taxes on existing residents. The bond will fund a public water system on the Killington access road, which is known for having wells that are tainted by chemicals. If you've stayed in a hotel or condo on the access road, then you would have likely been told to drink bottled water. That will soon become a thing of the past.

The access road itself is also being upgraded to remove a steep grade at the intersection with Route 4, being rerouted at Snowshed and Ramshead base areas to go under the base area instead of over it. The pedestrian walkways are also being upgraded, with pedestrian crossings and bus pullouts being added, to improve utilization of public transit, and reduce the number of days when the resort parking lots are completely full.

With the water and road improvements, construction of the new village can begin, which will provide much needed lodging units to an area that has a severe lodging shortage. Any hotel rooms within 30 miles get booked weeks in advance. It's the biggest thing holding back Killington from gaining more skier visits, as they are too far away from population centers to be within day trip range.

The local workforce isn't being left out of the picture either, as workforce housing is going to be constructed at the intersection of Route 4 and Killington Road.

On the mountain, the village will be a catalyst for many improvements. Replacement of the Ramshead and Snowshed Lodges, and lifts at those base areas is now immanent. Expect to see a replacement of the Superstar lift too, and upgrades to snowmaking. This also makes the Killington/Pico interconnect far more likely to be a reality. Expect to see more things to do in the short off-season as well.

I think it's going to be an exciting decade ahead for The Beast, and I can't wait to see everything come together.

 

[Benny Profane]

"With the water and road improvements, construction of the new village can begin, which will provide much needed lodging units to an area that has a severe lodging shortage. Any hotel rooms within 30 miles get booked weeks in advance. It's the biggest thing holding back Killington from gaining more skier visits, as they are too far away from population centers to be within day trip range."

This is all pretty ridiculous, and will just further suck any soul out of the Killington region and concentrate any sort of income from visiting skiers into the accounts of Powdr and create more abandoned private, or, non Powdr businesses along Rt. 4 and soon that cancer will spread up the access road. Nobody has been investing in new hotels and restaurants for years now, because of the plans for this village, and the shift of weekly visits out west by the ten day gaper family instead of driving to Vermont. Look at the crappy motels abandoned on Rt. 4 or, if they are alive, house homeless drug problems. Now we'll be forced to sleep in Powdr beds, because they'll drive everyone else out of business with this taxpayer funded boondoggle. Sad. And it will have as much soul as that pathetic Stratton village twenty years after it was built.

But, as long as they make snow and groom as much as they do, late season, I'll be there Just avoiding the stupid drink and food pricing. Gawd, the food. So awful, especially for the money.

And Superstar was going to be replaced anyway. It's about forty years old, and very heavily used.

 

[snoloco]

This is all pretty ridiculous, and will just further suck any soul out of the Killington region and concentrate any sort of income from visiting skiers into the accounts of Powdr and create more abandoned private, or, non Powdr businesses along Rt. 4 and soon that cancer will spread up the access road.

Wrong. The existing access road businesses are bursting at the seams. Try getting a condo or hotel room. There is room for growth.

Nobody has been investing in new hotels and restaurants for years now, because of the plans for this village, and the shift of weekly visits out west by the ten day gaper family instead of driving to Vermont. Look at the crappy motels abandoned on Rt. 4 or, if they are alive, house homeless drug problems.

Also wrong. Those motels went derelict during a bad era for Killington. They faced a decade of declining skier visits, and at the time had limited summer business. The trend of declining skier visits has been reversed, and they are as busy as ever in the summer. To support investment in lodging, you need year round business, and that is what Killington has now.

Now we'll be forced to sleep in Powdr beds, because they'll drive everyone else out of business

No you won't. You'll still have all the same options you've got today. It just might be slightly easier to find a hotel room for the nights you want.

with this taxpayer funded boondoggle. Sad.

The taxes only affect the new units they are building. There is no risk to existing taxpayers. They do get a public water system, a better access road, and employee housing though. That's why 75% of local taxpayers voted yes.

And it will have as much soul as that pathetic Stratton village twenty years after it was built.

How do you know it will be the same? Stratton's village was built hastily under Intrawest, when they did not have the year round business to support it. Much different situation than Killington.

But, as long as they make snow and groom as much as they do, late season, I'll be there Just avoiding the stupid drink and food pricing. Gawd, the food. So awful, especially for the money.

So after all this incessant complaining, you'll still ski there.

And Superstar was going to be replaced anyway. It's about forty years old, and very heavily used.

Now all of those lift projects will be of higher priority.

 

[Brownski]

So after all this incessant complaining, you'll still ski there.

The irony

 

[Benny Profane]

You're young and naive. You'll learn. Unless you've been hired as a virtual salesman/spokesman.

Skiing is a finite market that is shrinking. It's Boomer dominated, and the Boomers are dying.You somehow assume that this boondoggle will actually attract market share. All it will do is shift money from the non corporate Powdr bank accounts to Powdr bank accounts. Monopoly power. And, with Monopoly power comes monopoly pricing. At a certain point, the gaper family will just say, let's go to Vail or Breck or SLC, for the same amount, just like they've been slowly doing for thirty years. Why spend the same amount for icy Vermont? It's what killed the Catskills, and that arrogance will kill Vermont skiing. Cheap airfare to better places.

Walk around the Stratton village and tell me that's good for the soul of skiing. But, google Soul, first.

 

[Campgottagopee]

The irony

Amen!

 

[Benny Profane]

Oh, and never forget, Powdr is the company that lost it's prized cash cow, Park City, to Vail, due to a stupid clerical error. They are not smart people. Don't get me going about when they brought State Troopers in to shut down the Mogul challenge parking lot party, a forty year tradition. Add the million dollar World Cup stupidity for dressing on the stupid salad.

Grooming is pretty good, though.

 

[snoloco]

Skiing is a finite market that is shrinking. It's Boomer dominated, and the Boomers are dying.

Skier visits are up over the past few years, so no, its not shrinking.

You somehow assume that this boondoggle will actually attract market share.

It will increase market share because lodging is always sold out now, and that drives people to other ski areas.

All it will do is shift money from the non corporate Powdr bank accounts to Powdr bank accounts. Monopoly power. And, with Monopoly power comes monopoly pricing.

The units will be privately owned, so that is not monopoly pricing. Monopoly pricing is when demand so far outstrips supply that you can't find a hotel room within 30 miles on a weekend, and if you can find one, then it will be ridiculously overpriced.

At a certain point, the gaper family will just say, let's go to Vail or Breck or SLC, for the same amount, just like they've been slowly doing for thirty years. Why spend the same amount for icy Vermont? It's what killed the Catskills, and that arrogance will kill Vermont skiing. Cheap airfare to better places.

Wrong. Once you factor in airfare, a rental car, and having to leave two full days just for travel, then you will likely stay in the east and drive, especially for a shorter trip. Most of Killington's growth has been in extended weekend trips, with people taking Friday or Monday off and making it a long weekend.

Walk around the Stratton village and tell me that's good for the soul of skiing. But, google Soul, first.

It's easier to find lodging near Stratton than it is at Killington. It's easier to find lodging near almost any other ski area in the Northeast. It's a severe shortage that puts a stranglehold on Killington's skier visits. I don't care about soul.

 

[Brownski]

Walk around the Stratton village and tell me that's good for the soul of skiing. But, google Soul, first.

Ha! Good line. And you’re right about this one. Those resort villages are terrible places, the height of phoniness. Nothing to celebrate

 

[riverc0il]

Skiing is a finite market that is shrinking. It's Boomer dominated, and the Boomers are dying.You somehow assume that this boondoggle will actually attract market share. All it will do is shift money from the non corporate Powdr bank accounts to Powdr bank accounts. Monopoly power. And, with Monopoly power comes monopoly pricing. At a certain point, the gaper family will just say, let's go to Vail or Breck or SLC, for the same amount, just like they've been slowly doing for thirty years. Why spend the same amount for icy Vermont? It's what killed the Catskills, and that arrogance will kill Vermont skiing. Cheap airfare to better places.

Walk around the Stratton village and tell me that's good for the soul of skiing. But, google Soul, first.

I am right behind ya, Stratton's base Village is the ugliest and soulless ski resort boondoggle south of Sugarbush's faux-barn silo. But I hope you aren't suggesting that K is the polar opposite and is a soulful resort? I appreciate K for what it is, but soulful it is not.

I also wonder how long the resort buildout can continue. It seems like everything should be against the long term viability of ski resorts... the eventual boomer die out, the lack of new youthful skiers (at replacement rate), the fact that younger people have more debt and lower buying power, climate change, etc.

Regarding the small mom and pop resort town lodges dying out, that isn't a K specific thing. That is happening all over. And given the lack of infrastructure improvement and maintenance done on those types of places, it shouldn't be a surprise. No one wants to pay the going rate to stay at an off-mountain dive without modern amenities (I mean, I would for less than market rate, but most resort goers are not interested in that).